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Übersetzungsforum Deutsch-Englisch nothing short of staggering.... »
« with a twist    

English-German Translation of
transparent = invisible

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transparent = invisible ?  
von Kornelius (DE), 2010-07-04, 12:14  like dislike  Spam?  
Found on an American website about digital photography:
"A fundamental component of the Micro Four Thirds system design is the use of software to correct certain lens aberrations. For most users this is completely transparent - the camera corrects both the viewfinder image 'on the fly', and the JPEG files it records."
The context suggests that users won't notice the system working. To me, it means the opposite: It is clearly obvious to users that the system is working and how it goes about that - because everything is transparent, nothing is hidden under the surface.
Or am I wrong?
von feodor (DE), 2010-07-04, 12:30  like dislike  Spam?  
ich verstehe das so: die funktion selbst ist unsichtbar, das ergebnis jedoch nicht.
du hast recht, unter der oberfläche wird nichts versteckt (=ergebnis), man sieht dass das system arbeitet, aber nicht wie.
You are wrong.  #528569
von Jim46 (US), 2010-07-04, 12:35  like dislike  Spam?  
The corrections are made automatically, with no input from the user.  Casual users will likely
be unaware that their camera has this feature.
I'm fully aware of what the author means - I just thought he/she did not put it right  #528572
von Kornelius (DE), 2010-07-04, 12:43  like dislike  Spam?  
I would have chosen: "For most users this is completely invisible / hidden"
Or would you say: "For most drivers the ignition sparks are completely transparent" ?
A fine line.  #528573
von Jim46 (US), 2010-07-04, 12:57  like dislike  Spam?  
In the case of the camera function, "transparent" is better.  The results are actually visible in the
viewfinder and in the final photo.
I would say that the ignition system is also transparent.  I expect there are drivers who do not even know
what an ignition system is.
The sparks, however, are very visible events.  They are hidden from view normally.
The author's usage is correct.  #528575
von wandle (GB), 2010-07-04, 13:09  like dislike  Spam?  
'Transparent' means 'able to be seen through'.  If you have an object A on a table covered by a sheet B, and if you can still see A, then B is transparent.  If something were 100% transparent, then it would be invisible.  

Here the image correction process is said to be transparent in most cases because it will not be visible to the user, that is, it will not appear to intervene between the inital view and the end result.

I would not apply either 'transparent' or 'invisible' to the sparking plugs or any other part of the engine.
Hmm. So what does Transparency International do, then? Sweep corruption under a transparent carpet?  #528577
von Kornelius (DE), 2010-07-04, 13:22  like dislike  Spam?  
Presumably   #528578
von wandle (GB), Last modified: 2010-07-04, 13:33  like dislike  Spam?  
they promote transparency on an international basis.  
'Transparency' in public office means the process and actions of officialdom are 'transparent', they can be seen through, they do not hide anything.
von Martin, 2010-07-04, 13:36  like dislike  Spam?  70.19.31....
IMO "invisible" or "hidden" are both better choices, and "transparent" is inappropriate.  The correction of a jpeg file occurs beyond sight, or am I missing something?
agree with Martin, who's not missing anything.  #528581
von MichaelK, 2010-07-04, 13:45  like dislike  Spam?  71.241.28....
The thing is that "transparent" has been used for so long now to mean "easily grasped" or "quickly understood" that this meaning comes to mind immediately. Almost certainly, that meaning was not the intent of the author.
 'completely transparent' means 'invisible'  (Isn't this fun?)  #528583
von wandle (GB), Last modified: 2010-07-04, 13:51  like dislike  Spam?  
What is the writer's intention?
He wants to say most users won't see any difference between the viewfinder image and the jpeg file.  But some users will.
'For most users this is completely transparent' means the software editing process is (a) in most cases invisible to the user, but (b) in some cases, software editing will produce a difference between the initial view and the end result. In this case, it will appear to come between beginning and end.
wandle: the intent is to say that the correction of an optical problem will go completely unnoticed.   #528587
von MichaelK, 2010-07-04, 13:58  like dislike  Spam?  71.241.28....
But he incorrectly uses the word 'transparent,' which produces immediate connotations of "easily seen through." Nothing is being seen—it all happens out of sight of the user.
MichaelK  #528591
von wandle (GB), Last modified: 2010-07-04, 16:04  like dislike  Spam?  
At the risk of repeating myself, I can only reply that 'completely transparent' means the same as 'invisible'.  If 'invisible' is an appropriate expression here, then 'completely transparent' is too.
wandle: I understand what you're saying, but the problem is the other meaning of "transparent."  #528596
von MichaelK, 2010-07-04, 14:28  like dislike  Spam?  71.241.28....
For example, "a transparent lie" is not an invisble lie, but a lie that's easily seen. What is transparent in that meaning is that which is supposed to cover up the lie—the masking layer, so to speak. Good stuff, keeps me thinking! :-)
And I thought the lie was supposed to be the cover  #528598
von wandle (GB), 2010-07-04, 14:33  like dislike  Spam?  
(concealing the truth) and a transparent lie, like a transparent cover, is one that can be seen through.
"transparent" is actually in this list of antagonyms (words with two contradictory meanings)  #528607
von Kornelius (DE), 2010-07-04, 16:08  like dislike  Spam?  
durchsichtig -- oder?  #528613
von wandle (GB), Last modified: 2010-07-04, 17:03  like dislike  Spam?  
4; Kornelius: re 'antagonyms'

Transparent: Easily seen ("His motives were transparent.") invisible

(from the Aravind Academy, Tamil Nadu).

The above entry is supposed to show two opposite meanings of 'transparent', (a) easliy seen (b) invisible.

The only trouble with this is that neither (a) nor (b) is a true meaning of 'transparent', which means 'able to be seen through'.  (It is true that 'completely transparent' or '100% transparent' implies 'invisible', but 'transparent' on its own does not.)

The supposed example given is not correct English. The correct usage is to say that someone's conduct is transparent, meaning that his motives can be seen beneath the front he presents.

His conduct or behaviour is transparent, his motives are apparent.

Unfortunately, most of the 'antagonyms' listed on that page (by a teacher of English!) are no better than this and many are worse.

Interestingly, it seems the page may have been taken down, as I can only find it in a google cache.

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