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Frage:
got to learn  
von Noobie, 2015-01-26, 12:36  like dislike  Spam?  84.180.150....
"While he was in Spain, he got to learn some Spanish." Man könnte hier ja einfach sagen "he had to learn some Spanish", oder? Wofür steht das "got"? Ist "get to learn" ein phrasal verb?
Antwort: 
got to = müssen (AE)  #786339
von Ivy (DE), Last modified: 2015-01-26, 12:41  like dislike  Spam?  
Antwort: 
und BE?  #786340
von Noobie, 2015-01-26, 12:47  like dislike  Spam?  84.180.150....
...he had got to learn some Spanisch. --> im BE wäre es jetzt so korrekt?
Antwort: 
Got to  #786341
von Catesse (AU), 2015-01-26, 12:48  like dislike  Spam?  
There is no sense of compulsion in this context.
"I have got to go"  "Ich muss gehen". - Yes.
But in this case, "He got to learn some Spanish" it means something like "He had the opportunity to learn", "It was natural that he learned", "He happened to learn", "He succeeded in learning".
If you said, "He had got to learn" - yes, there is necessity involved, but it is rotten English.
Antwort: 
got to  #786342
von Jim46 (US), 2015-01-26, 12:51  like dislike  Spam?  
In this case it doesn't mean "had to" (musste), instead he had the opportunity (Gelegenheit)
to learn Spanish.
Chat:     
von Jim46 (US), 2015-01-26, 12:53  like dislike  Spam?  
 #786343
Catesse was faster.
Antwort: 
thanks  #786344
von Noobie, 2015-01-26, 12:57  like dislike  Spam?  84.180.150....
Okay, im Sinne von Gelegenheit verstehe ich die Sache.
Ist das üblich so?
Antwort: 
von Jim46 (US), 2015-01-26, 13:04  like dislike  Spam?  
 #786345
I have got to do it  =  I must do it.
I got to do it  =  I was able, had the opportunity to do it.
Antwort: 
Habe diese Bedeutung hier nachgetragen  #786346
von rabend (DE/FR), Last modified: 2015-01-26, 13:06  like dislike  Spam?  
Antwort: 
"to got to"  (so in dict.) ist m.E. falsch; es gbt kein Verb "to got to", auch nicht im Amerikanischen  #786348
anonymous, 2015-01-26, 13:09  like dislike  Spam?  77.10.16....
es gibt nur "to get" mit den Formen got (gotten) als Vergangenheit und Partizip.
Aber es gibt "to have got"  -  ein idiomatischer Ausdruck mit den oben diskutierten Bedeutungen
Antwort: 
thanks  #786350
von Noobie, 2015-01-26, 13:12  like dislike  Spam?  84.180.150....
danke, habe jetzt alles verstanden
Antwort: 
von ddr (AT), 2015-01-26, 13:34  like dislike  Spam?  
 #786351
re: to got to
Mir scheint das auch falsch, aber nachdem 2 Amerikaner für den Eintrag gestimmt haben, wage ich es nicht, daran herumzudoktern. Vielleicht kann sich das ein native speaker anschauen?
Antwort: 
grammar  #786354
von Jim46 (US), 2015-01-26, 13:54  like dislike  Spam?  
I think got to, meaning have to is bad grammar, but it surely is often used.
Even have got is colloquial according to this dictionary:
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/got?s=t

I have (got) to do it today.  "Got" is completely unnecessary here, but adds stress.
Chat:     
von iriemonloggedout, 2015-01-26, 14:03  like dislike  Spam?  80.144.99....
 #786357
I#ve heard of it as well (BE). Perhaps this will help http://english.stackexchange.com/questions/16104/get-to-do-something
Antwort: 
Example  #786358
von Catesse (AU), Last modified: 2015-01-26, 14:05  like dislike  Spam?  
"I have wanted to do that for a long time and today, at last, I got to do it." = I had the opportunity.
It is inelegant English, but it is in common use.
At school it was just about a caning offence to use "get" or "got" in any sense at all; this was perhaps partly because of its ambiguities.
Chat:     
Some thoughts.  #786372
von MichaelK (US), Last modified: 2015-01-26, 14:52  like dislike  Spam?  
"Got to" expressing an obligation is the colloquial form of "have got to" or "have to."  It's used when context leaves no doubt as to meaning (It's been fun, but I got to go now). Sometimes, people will use the standard form with a contraction (I've got to...; she's got to...) and if they say it quickly, the abbreviated 'have' or 'is' may not be heard.

The belief that 'got' is improper is widespread, but not based on facts. Some people also believe that use of 'got' is typically AE. I don't think that's true either--it's more complicated than that. I believe 'got' is sometimes given a bum rap because it can sound awful, as in "Whatcha got there, buddy?"
Antwort: 
Got als Partikel  #786399
von atemp (US), Last modified: 2015-01-26, 21:09  like dislike  Spam?  
You have to see this! = one should/must/(are obliged to) see (also, one could benefit from seeing).
You have got to see this! = same meaning, but with particle for emphasis; like doch oder ja?

IMO about the only "legitimate" or fundamental use for get is in to get or to beget, the male complement of to bear, i.e. to be the sire or father of offspring. "Lo, and so-and-so begat the son bla bla", or as a noun: "That boy over there—is he your get?" All other uses of get/got as a catchall verb depend highly on context or idiom for meaning, to the despair of nonnative EN learners.
Chat:     
von Moor tawts, 2015-01-26, 16:52  like dislike  Spam?  209.148.58....
 #786407
In the first half of the  last century, folks in Brooklyn simply had to have that word at their disposal.  Wedda dey still gotta havit tidday,  I dunno who da hell knows d'ansa  tiddat.  So one is inclined to agree with Catesse--got is to be avoided, particularly in writing.   Yet MichaelK is right too (ainee awaze?), the word got has its role to play, particularly in spoken English, even in England in the 21st century.

British English and American English - British Council
https://learnenglish.britishcouncil.org/.../b...
In British English, 'have got' is often used for the possessive sense of 'have' and ' have got to' is informally used for ...
Antwort: 
Zumindest scheint bei dieser Eingabe im Infinitiv aber ein [coll.] Tag angebracht, oder?  #786508
von rabend (DE/FR), Last modified: 2015-01-27, 12:10  like dislike  Spam?  
http://contribute.dict.cc/?action=edit&id=658385&goback=2
to got to [Am.] = müssen

Also dann so:

to got to [esp. Am.] [coll.] [to have to] = müssen
Chat:     
rabend  #786524
von Catesse (AU), Last modified: 2015-01-27, 13:09  like dislike  Spam?  
It is in common use in Australia also and, as far as I know, in England, but Americans seem to be less sensitive to the problems.
Forgot to mention: a while ago, we had a Prime Minister who habitually said, "I gotta zip" when he meant that he had to hurry away. It sounded so odd, as though it was not something that he would say naturally, but he was condescending to the peasants.
Chat:     
Catesse  #786540
von rabend (DE/FR), Last modified: 2015-01-27, 13:37  like dislike  Spam?  
Wir haben auch in Frankreich die Erscheinung, dass Politiker sich gerne mit umgangssprachlichen Ausdrücken beim Wähler anbiedern. V. a. Chirac war stets bemüht, sich nicht anmerken zu lassen, dass er eigentlich ein gebildeter Mensch ist. Der einzige, der Umgangssprache und Argot "normal" spricht --- weil er nämlich unfähig ist, sich anders auszudrücken -- ist Sarkozy.  

Bist du mit meinem Tag-Vorschlag einverstanden, oder gehört er verändert?
Chat:     
von iriemonloggedout, 2015-01-27, 15:03  like dislike  Spam?  80.144.99....
 #786570
das ist aber nicht zu verwechseln mit der anderen Bedeutung - die Gelegenheit haben etw. zu tun, s. 14:03 und 14:05
Antwort: 
von rabend (DE/FR), 2015-01-27, 17:57  like dislike  Spam?  
 #786608
Deshalb "to have to".

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