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English-German Translation of
Sind Aussprachebeispiele

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Sind Aussprachebeispiele wie Voice: dependent by Zron eine Bereicherung für  
von Proteus-, 2015-05-29, 15:55  like dislike  Spam?  178.191.24....
Link  #802418
von Catesse (AU), 2015-05-29, 16:00  like dislike  Spam?  
Link does not retrieve anything that seems relevant.
von sunfunlili (DE/GB), 2015-05-29, 16:18  like dislike  Spam?  
variety?  #802428
von Lisa4dict loggedout, 2015-05-29, 17:06  like dislike  Spam?  99.11.162....
If we only allow people from, say Boston or Oxford to record we'll end up with a poor sampling of the language.  I tried to nail his accent, but couldn't quite place it.
von iriemonloggedout, 2015-05-29, 18:29  like dislike  Spam?  80.144.112....
just a stab in the dark... Louisiana/Alabama area ??
Wenn man so manche berühmten  #802468
von rabend (DE/FR), Last modified: 2015-05-29, 22:08  like dislike  Spam?  
amerikanischen oder gar britischen Filmschauspieler Südstaatler- (und sonstige) Akzente imitieren hört, warum dann nicht auch das?
Oral model  #802480
von Catesse (AU), 2015-05-30, 02:35  like dislike  Spam?  
Unlike the written basis of dict, which is designed to help people recognise semi-literate written text, the Audio section is meant to serve as a model to be used. There may be a range o f pronunciations acceptable for dict, but this is not one of them.
Zron's pronunciation is absolutely horrible. He seems to be an educated person, but the hard facts of life are that, outside his own region, such a pronunciation would cause a warning sign to flash up in the mind of the listener: "white trash". It may well be unreasonable and unjustifiable to judge a person's character and abilities by accent, but it would be cold, hard fact that anybody (outside the region) who went to a job interview with that accent would be unlikely to be successful in getting a job above driving a street-sweeping machine or the fall guy in a TV comedy.
Sorry if this is offensive, but the world can be a heartless unforgiving place, and I did not know whether to laugh or shudder.
One entry specifically: "manufacturer" pronounced as "manufacture". I could not bear to go past the first page.
Catesse  #802485
von lisa4dict loggedout, 2015-05-30, 04:16  like dislike  Spam?  24.98.105....
British pronunciation and Bostonian AE can not be the only acceptable pronunciations offered.  if I have any complaint about those recordings it is that the accent isn't pure.  He seems to hide his original one.  What makes the way they talk in some British burough that much more acceptable than what wide swaths of Southern North America is using.  To us what you call a "nice" accent sounds horrible.  Zron has an -ed ending and vowel-consonant combinations that are uncharacteristic of Southern American English.  But some of his vowel sounds do have a southern drawl to it.  Someone traveling or coming to live here is ill served with only BE examples on dict.  My take on it is: ask Zron to clarify his location and if someone doesn't like his recordings, provide an additional one as an alternative.
Lisa  #802486
von Catesse (AU), 2015-05-30, 04:40  like dislike  Spam?  
I have no doubt that my accent would sound peculiar in America. Or maybe even amusingly cute. In America most people thought I was English. In England most - or at least a good few - knew that I was not. When I was shopping in Strasbourg and spoke in French, I was often answered not in English but in German. Canadians abroad are often judged to be American; they hate that. My husband's accent was never Australian, but a lot of people whom he met briefly thought that he was from Northern England.
There is no such thing as a truly neutral accent; we are all marked and judged by it. If we try to lose own native accent, we may succeed, only to be judged as something else.
We should not be embarrassed by or ashamed of our native accents.. However, the function of dict Audio is to provide acceptable models for a non-native speaker to imitate. And Zron's accent could be an embarrassment when used inappropriately. I hope fervently that it is not going to be suggested that we take Indian-call-centre "English" as a suitable accent for dict.
Accent  #802488
von Catesse (AU), 2015-05-30, 04:55  like dislike  Spam?  
The persistence of one's native accent. Mathias Corman is a fascinating example. Senator. German native speaker born in Belgium. He did not begin to learn English until he was 20+, so they say. He speaks fluently and I have never heard him make a real mistake. He is one of the best orators in parliament, but you would never take him for an English native speaker. He speaks a little too fast; some of his vowels are a bit wide of the mark, and he constantly pronounces the "s" at the end of plurals in the German way.
His accent:
His history: Wikipedia(EN): Mathias_Cormann
The stars and stripes notwithstanding, I should think the speaker's origins are Balkan - perhaps he comes from former Yugoslavia ...  #802505
von Proteus-, 2015-05-30, 11:26  like dislike  Spam?  62.46.135....
von iriemonloggedout, 2015-05-30, 18:43  like dislike  Spam?  80.144.112....
I know many Germans who speak very, very good English. But they never lose their distinctive accent. Same goes for French people speaking English and British/Americans/Australians speaking German. There are not many people who "have an ear" for another language to the extent that people take them for natives when they hear them.
Another phenomenon: A Frenchman naturalized in the USA, his US wife and their child went to visit Spain. In Spanish, his accent was French, theirs AE.  #802598
von Proteus-, 2015-05-30, 21:24  like dislike  Spam?  62.46.130....
Accents  #802613
von Catesse (AU), 2015-05-31, 02:23  like dislike  Spam?  
I think that, for learning the really top-notch pronunciation of a language, one must not only learn the principles of orthography and the pronunciation of individual words, but also be able to alter subtly the shape of one's mouth. I suspect that the position of one's teeth is also determined to some extent by the amount of pressure that the tongue exerts on them in infancy.
The ultimate aim in learning a foreign language is to be able to "pass" as a native speaker. When I was learning Japanese, I realised that this would be forever impossible for me. It is enough to be able to make oneself understood without giving the listener a headache or a reason for hysterical laughter.
von iriemonloggedout, 2015-05-31, 04:23  like dislike  Spam?  80.144.112....
I don't think you need a different mouth shape. Melody, rhythm and other aspects can be acquired through careful listening and imitation. Children do this subconsciously. A wide variety of cultural and mentality aspects need to be assimilated. It's not just about the sound but also the content. Academic training on its own does not provide that.
von Catesse (AU), 2015-05-31, 05:03  like dislike  Spam?  
Maybe I did not explain that very well. I think that a speech therapist would probably know what I mean.
Where does that come from?  #802616
von Lisa4dict loggedout, 2015-05-31, 05:14  like dislike  Spam?  99.11.162....
"However, the function of dict Audio is to provide acceptable models for a non-native speaker to imitate."
That certainly doesn't go for the German ones (!?!)  I haven't sampled many, but found a few that were of interest for variety's sake.  I would certainly not aspire to sound like someone from Bavaria or Saxony when visiting Hamburg nor one of the others when going to Munich.  The above rule would limit people allowed to make recordings to actors and (some) newscasters.  That simply can't be the intent.  If I get the options to listen to recordings I'd like to have a variety of accents to choose from to see what might fit me and my surroundings best.  There's no such thing as a "model" accent.

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